DVR backend comparisons?
Added by Jim Abernathy almost 6 years ago
I've been playing with tvheadend for a couple of weeks now and have it running successfully on an Intel NUC with an external USB 2TB drive and also a Raspberry PI 3B+ with a 2TB external USB drive.
I'm impressed with how well it works. I have not stressed it out yet, but on the RP3 I have recorded 2 HDTV programs and watched one of them delayed via Kodi, running on a Nvidia Shield TV, at the same time.
My previous experience with DVRs is Mythtv. I've been using it for a really long time. Are there users here who have used both? I've always thought you needed a decent PC to run Mythtv backend. Never challenged the hardware. 4 HDTV at the same time is my maximum load. I'm wondering how much I can expect out of the RP3 with tvheadend.
Jim A
Replies (4)
RE: DVR backend comparisons? - Added by Em Smith almost 6 years ago
I've used both and have around 700 channels from multiple sources with overlap of channels, so is vaguely similar to your setup.
Since digital TV, I don't think MythTV has needed as much resources, but its scheduler is a relatively big hit. I've read people run it on a Pi, but presumably they don't have many recording rules (I have a couple of hundred) or channels. It runs fine on my old hardware and takes significantly less memory than my tvh (around 1/3) since information is stored in the database not in memory. Move DB on to a cheap ssd and it is fine.
MythTV has the best scheduler of any DVR. It can resolve conflicts, schedule programs to record later to ensure it can record another 'one time showing' programme, allow any programme to prefer any tuner (so prefer higher quality satellite for movie and low quality aerial for news; re-record an SD programme if it is later shown in HD), etc. But the Kodi integration has always felt poor and would occasionally hang. Retuning (scanning for new channels) is tedious if running headless due to only being X11.
I've recorded maybe eight-or-so programmes at the same time with it. You're unlikely to hit any limitation nowadays since disks are so fast and it's just a straight bit copy.
TVH has good failover of tuners, so sometimes one of my tuners will fail to tune (despite being available), and tvh will use another tuner instead. It's tuning of new channels is relatively easy. The dev version has artwork, which I find useful, and a number of filters such as by season and by year, which helps when you only want to record 'S9 or later of X' or 'all 4* movies made after 1990'.
I've recorded 30-or-so programmes at the same time (by mistake) from attached tuners.
Its Kodi integration is good since one of the developers of the plugin pushes through Kodi interface changes too in order to get new features in.
Tvheadend also has good sat>ip support and seems to have better tablet integration.
Tvheadend's problem (with few tuners) is that its scheduler is basic. Even with numerous tuners, I've had a number of occasions where programmes have been missed, which never happened with MythTV.
The limitation with Pi (from what I understand) is that its network and all USB ports share the same bus, so you are limited by how much you can record (especially if using a NAS instead of a usb drive). So, USB2 is 480mb/s but say your stream is 20mb/s (from network), 20mb/s (write to disk); then if you're streaming it would be read from disk 20mb/s and 20mb/s write to client. So, you'd probably be limited to around 5 client (40mb/s + 40mb/s = 80mb/s; 480/80=6, but assume lose some through general overhead). So, not the biggest of limitations, but something you could hit in holiday seasons.
RE: DVR backend comparisons? - Added by Jim Abernathy almost 6 years ago
Thanks, that's a very good and detailed comparison. I'd agree with all your Mythtv points as I've run it for years. Since I would only use either for OTA HDHR recordings I would never record more than 4 shows at once. My Mythtv-backend is also my NAS for the home backups and file sharing. So it's built around those requirements and is overkill for either mythtv or tvheadend. I have both HDHR tuners, Quatro and Duo, on the same GBE switch with the HTS and Mythtv backends.
Since Mythtv has added mythhdhrrecorder to use TCP api for HDHR and HTS has a way to setup iptv m3u's to do the same, I can share the HDHRs between both backends and my Nvidia Shield TV Live TV as long as I keep the total tuners uses at one time below 6.
I'm going to parallel them both for a while and see what I learn.
The real game changer for me was the recent addition of a Nvidia Shield TV on my main UHD 4K TV. Now I have one device that can have apps for Kodi-HTS, Mythtv-frontend, SlingTV, Prime Video, Hulu, ESPN+, and ProgTV. By using a Logitech Harmony Smart Control remote and hub I can use one remote for everything using native buttons for each app.
I'm thinking TVheadend on RP3 would be perfect for my RV. I don't have a DVR when I travel. Mythtv is too hard to setup the XMLTV EPG so you want to leave it alone. HTS is simplier for that and when traveling in an RV your zipcode changes frequently. So I need to be able to setup new channels and EPG quickly so I can record OTA shows.
Thanks again for your thoughts.
Jim A
RE: DVR backend comparisons? - Added by Em Smith almost 6 years ago
RPi3 sounds ideal for the RV. You're right, the problem nowadays is the PCs are overkill for just recording tv. But, the problem is that when you try and downgrade you realize that you miss all those little addons so you end up running two machines for a while, before going back to the one big one as being easier to maintain
Does SD allow you to frequently change your zipcode? I think it used to restrict to a couple of changes a month.
In Kodi, there's an addon [[https://github.com/edit4ever/script.module.tvh2kodi]]. This simplifies some of the channel scan options since it plugs in to Kodi and has a nice friendly 1,2,3 menu with big buttons, rather than the tvh webui. Might make it easier when on the road since it's easier to explain to family "press 1, then 3" rather than "go to this website, click a,b,c,scan,wait,map,refresh,switch program,refresh..."
There's also his SchedulesDirect downloader [[https://github.com/edit4ever/script.module.sd4tvh]], which again might be easier when on the road rather than logging in and editing xmltv config files.
I haven't used either for a while but they are maintained.
Interesting about the Shield+Harmony btw.
RE: DVR backend comparisons? - Added by Jim Abernathy almost 6 years ago
Not sure about limits on SD zipcode change. But I wouldn't go to the trouble to change the EPG unless setup at a location for a while anyway.
I'll look at you addon suggestions. I'm might even put but LibreELEC on the RP3 since HTS frontend and backend are included as addons.
I've used the Harmony Smartcontrols and remote for years. It supports multiple activities and each one can have multiple devices it controls. For the Shield I even add a fake virtual Windows Keyboard so I can have the Harmony remote send keyboard commands to Kodi like "x" for stop and "space" for pause/play.
Jim A