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Why is this so complex?

Added by Tiago Silva about 8 years ago

It's probably a stupid and newbie question, but i'm struggling to understand how can my crappy old crt tv, tune every channel available with a simple scan, and i'm here struggling with trying to guess parameters for muxes? Can't this be easier?


Replies (28)

RE: Why is this so complex? - Added by Mark Clarkstone about 8 years ago

Tiago Silva wrote:

It's probably a stupid and newbie question, but i'm struggling to understand how can my crappy old crt tv, tune every channel available with a simple scan, and i'm here struggling with trying to guess parameters for muxes? Can't this be easier?

Your TV does one (or a mix) of the following:

  • It will scan all available frequencies for active muxes/services - many TVs will only scan a limited number of frequencies and bandwidth(s) common to your country.
  • It will try and tune to a pre-defined frequency/mux (or scan until it finds one), and generally in many cases this mux will have information relating to other muxes available on the local network (NIT), at which point it will then attempt to tune to all other muxes present in the NIT, and if those muxes have NITs it'll scan those too (if different).

Tvheadend does the latter of the two options provided that it knows where to look, either using a pre-defined mux list or using a mux you've added yourself, just make sure that "Mux discovery" ("Network discovery" in 4.1.xxxx) is enabled.

RE: Why is this so complex? - Added by Tiago Silva about 8 years ago

Thank you for the answer.

Can you point me in the right direction in regards to the pre-defined mux to add?

I'm from Portugal and i have cable tv, i tried 474000000 because i found it in a forum somewhere, but it complains the scan fails because of invalid arguments.
So even if this frequency is right i guess i still need to guess the other arguments.

RE: Why is this so complex? - Added by Jonathan Thomson about 8 years ago

What version of TVHeadend are you running?

Who is your cable provider?

And to answer your question why TVHeadend is more complex than your 'crappy CRT' - it's because TVHeadend is vastly more flexible than your TV which, you have to remember, was designed with consumers in mind, whereas TVHeadend is designed with enthusiasts in mind, it's not a consumer product (in my opinion) - that doesn't mean we won't get you sorted however.

RE: Why is this so complex? - Added by Tiago Silva about 8 years ago

I tell you the specific version when i get home, but i've tried 4.0, 4.2 and the latest nightly version of tvheadend.

My cable provider is NOS, and i even tried the frequencies at their website (http://www.nos.pt/particulares/televisao/canais/Pages/plano-de-frequencias.aspx).

But since the issue seems to be invalid arguments maybe its the constellation or Symbol Rate that i can't leave AUTO.

RE: Why is this so complex? - Added by Tiago Silva about 8 years ago

my TvHeadEnd is at version:

HTS Tvheadend 4.1-2281 ~ LibreELEC Tvh-addon v7.0.444

RE: Why is this so complex? - Added by Jonathan Thomson about 8 years ago

Thanks for confirming your version.

I spent a bit of time yesterday searching for tuning details for NOS Portugal and there is very little information out there. Can I just confirm that they are a cable provider running a DVB-C network? A lot of information on NOS relates to satellite broadcasts (on Hispasat I believe) and I can't find much/anything about the tuning parameters for their DVB-C network.

I did note that for the UK cable provider "Virgin Media", the "Delivery System" is "DVB-C/ANNEX-C" - have you tried that with one of the frequencies from the NOS website? Also remember that the frequencies are in Hz so RTP 1 (196.25) is 196250000 Hz. I think the most important piece of information you are missing is the symbol rate - you can't leave it as zero, and I don't think tvheadend can detect it, so you need to do some digging to try and find the symbol rate for NOS. Do you have access to an official tuner or some other device which might reveal the tuning parameters?

The rest will be trial and error - it might be nice if you manage to work it out to offer your tuning parameters to the community and perhaps they can be included in future builds so any other NOS users don't go through this pain :)

RE: Why is this so complex? - Added by Jonathan Thomson about 8 years ago

Bit more info, I found a thread on a Portuguese site which mentions the following:

Symbol Rate: 6875
Constellation: QAM64

Put those two in with 196250000 and see if you get a lock. Don't forget to enable network discovery (new and updated muxes) so that tvheadend will use the channel you lock to to find other channels automatically.

RE: Why is this so complex? - Added by Tiago Silva about 8 years ago

Thx for your patience.

Yes i knew i had to insert the value in Hz and not in Mhz, and i did try once the Annex-C setting, but haven't tried it again.

by the way in the NOS site the frequencies change according to City (there's a dropdown to choose), for my city (Braga) that's the SIC frequency.

I tried it like this:

With and without Annex-C and both failed, strangely without any reason why on the debuglog:
Loglevel debug: enabled
2016-10-19 12:46:14.273 mpegts: 196.25MHz in NOS - tuning on Silicon Labs Si2168 : DVB-C #0
2016-10-19 12:47:05.268 mpegts: 196.25MHz in NOS - tuning on Silicon Labs Si2168 : DVB-C #0

RE: Why is this so complex? - Added by Kev S about 8 years ago

The frequency lists you linked to are titled "PAL BG" and show only one channel per frequency - makes it look like it's an analogue network. https://www.tvchannellists.com/List_of_channels_on_NOS_(Cable) shows a more typical DVB list, but without any technical details.

Do you have a TV which is already tuned to the digital channels - e.g. SuperRTL? - if so there might be someone on the TV's menus which allows you to view the technical information and find out the frequency.

If you can't find that information - try adding a DVB-C Network, and choosing the various pre-defined countries in turn, there's a possibility there will be some overlap and eveentually one multiplex will be found from where the others may also appear (make sure Network discovery is set to New and Changed Muxes).

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9KvRocUF9Nw Implies you might have to set your country to Sweden to get the TV to scan DVB-C channels if your TV was made before Portugal started DVB-C broadcasts.

http://www.geralforum.com/board/showthread.php/613359-zon-nos-sunray4-v2-sinal-em-dvb-c has some of the settings for Porto - might be worth giving a try?

RE: Why is this so complex? - Added by Tiago Silva about 8 years ago

I'm trying the approach of adding several pre-defined lists trying to find a match but so far i got nothing.

My Tv is crappy and old, and doesn't show much information about the tunned channels.
I tried the setting for Porto and they didn't work either.

I have a windows machine on which this is pretty easy (making me again question, why is this so hard? surely it should be simpler), and the tv tunner is working, but so far i couldn't find any working software that also gives me the information i need for here. Maybe you know some i can try?

RE: Why is this so complex? - Added by Kev S about 8 years ago

I've not used DVB-C myself (in the UK you aren't allowed to connect your own equipment - even analogue was a pain as all the channels were on unusual frequencies).

ProgDVB is normally good for DVB-T2 and DVB-S2.

Which windows software are you using? Perhaps someone will be able to help you view the technical information).

RE: Why is this so complex? - Added by Tiago Silva about 8 years ago

I've tried Media Portal 2
and even exported a list of frequencies, but i wasn't able to use them :/

<channels>
    <channel GrabEpg="False" IdChannel="1" IsRadio="False" IsTv="True" LastGrabTime="2000-1-1 0:0:0" SortOrder="10000" TimesWatched="0" TotalTimeWatched="2000-1-1 0:0:0" VisibleInGuide="True" DisplayName="Porto Canal HD" ChannelNumber="10000">
      <mappings>
        <map IdCard="3" IdChannel="1" IdChannelMap="1" />
      </mappings>
      <TuningDetails>
        <tune IdChannel="1" IdTuning="1" Bandwidth="8" ChannelNumber="10000" ChannelType="4" CountryId="31" Diseqc="0" FreeToAir="False" Frequency="690000" MajorChannel="-1" MinorChannel="-1" Modulation="0" Name="Porto Canal HD" NetworkId="54" PmtPid="817" Polarisation="0" Provider="SID Porto Canal HD" ServiceId="1650" SwitchingFrequency="0" Symbolrate="0" TransportId="73" TuningSource="0" VideoSource="0" AudioSource="0" IsVCRSignal="False" SatIndex="-1" InnerFecRate="-1" Band="0" Pilot="-1" RollOff="-1" Url="" Bitrate="0" />
      </TuningDetails>
    </channel>
    <channel GrabEpg="False" IdChannel="2" IsRadio="False" IsTv="True" LastGrabTime="2000-1-1 0:0:0" SortOrder="10000" TimesWatched="0" TotalTimeWatched="2000-1-1 0:0:0" VisibleInGuide="True" DisplayName="Novo SD TSC13 -02" ChannelNumber="10000">
      <mappings>
        <map IdCard="3" IdChannel="2" IdChannelMap="2" />
      </mappings>
      <TuningDetails>
        <tune IdChannel="2" IdTuning="2" Bandwidth="8" ChannelNumber="10000" ChannelType="4" CountryId="31" Diseqc="0" FreeToAir="False" Frequency="690000" MajorChannel="-1" MinorChannel="-1" Modulation="0" Name="Novo SD TSC13 -02" NetworkId="54" PmtPid="817" Polarisation="0" Provider="Novo SD TSC13 -02" ServiceId="1651" SwitchingFrequency="0" Symbolrate="0" TransportId="73" TuningSource="0" VideoSource="0" AudioSource="0" IsVCRSignal="False" SatIndex="-1" InnerFecRate="-1" Band="0" Pilot="-1" RollOff="-1" Url="" Bitrate="0" />
      </TuningDetails>
    </channel>
    <channel GrabEpg="False" IdChannel="3" IsRadio="False" IsTv="True" LastGrabTime="2000-1-1 0:0:0" SortOrder="10000" TimesWatched="0" TotalTimeWatched="2000-1-1 0:0:0" VisibleInGuide="True" DisplayName="Novo SD TSC13 -00" ChannelNumber="10000">
      <mappings>
        <map IdCard="3" IdChannel="3" IdChannelMap="3" />
      </mappings>
      <TuningDetails>
        <tune IdChannel="3" IdTuning="3" Bandwidth="8" ChannelNumber="10000" ChannelType="4" CountryId="31" Diseqc="0" FreeToAir="False" Frequency="690000" MajorChannel="-1" MinorChannel="-1" Modulation="0" Name="Novo SD TSC13 -00" NetworkId="54" PmtPid="817" Polarisation="0" Provider="SID Novo SD TSC13 -00" ServiceId="1652" SwitchingFrequency="0" Symbolrate="0" TransportId="73" TuningSource="0" VideoSource="0" AudioSource="0" IsVCRSignal="False" SatIndex="-1" InnerFecRate="-1" Band="0" Pilot="-1" RollOff="-1" Url="" Bitrate="0" />
      </TuningDetails>
    </channel>
    <channel GrabEpg="False" IdChannel="4" IsRadio="False" IsTv="True" LastGrabTime="2000-1-1 0:0:0" SortOrder="10000" TimesWatched="0" TotalTimeWatched="2000-1-1 0:0:0" VisibleInGuide="True" DisplayName="Caça e Pesca" ChannelNumber="10000">
      <mappings>
        <map IdCard="3" IdChannel="4" IdChannelMap="4" />
      </mappings>
      <TuningDetails>
        <tune IdChannel="4" IdTuning="4" Bandwidth="8" ChannelNumber="10000" ChannelType="4" CountryId="31" Diseqc="0" FreeToAir="False" Frequency="690000" MajorChannel="-1" MinorChannel="-1" Modulation="0" Name="Caça e Pesca" NetworkId="54" PmtPid="817" Polarisation="0" Provider="SID Caça e Pesca" ServiceId="1653" SwitchingFrequency="0" Symbolrate="0" TransportId="73" TuningSource="0" VideoSource="0" AudioSource="0" IsVCRSignal="False" SatIndex="-1" InnerFecRate="-1" Band="0" Pilot="-1" RollOff="-1" Url="" Bitrate="0" />
      </TuningDetails>
    </channel>
    <channel GrabEpg="False" IdChannel="5" IsRadio="False" IsTv="True" LastGrabTime="2000-1-1 0:0:0" SortOrder="10000" TimesWatched="0" TotalTimeWatched="2000-1-1 0:0:0" VisibleInGuide="True" DisplayName="A&amp;E" ChannelNumber="10000">
      <mappings>
        <map IdCard="3" IdChannel="5" IdChannelMap="5" />
      </mappings>
      <TuningDetails>
        <tune IdChannel="5" IdTuning="5" Bandwidth="8" ChannelNumber="10000" ChannelType="4" CountryId="31" Diseqc="0" FreeToAir="False" Frequency="690000" MajorChannel="-1" MinorChannel="-1" Modulation="0" Name="A&amp;E" NetworkId="54" PmtPid="817" Polarisation="0" Provider="SID A&amp;E" ServiceId="1654" SwitchingFrequency="0" Symbolrate="0" TransportId="73" TuningSource="0" VideoSource="0" AudioSource="0" IsVCRSignal="False" SatIndex="-1" InnerFecRate="-1" Band="0" Pilot="-1" RollOff="-1" Url="" Bitrate="0" />
      </TuningDetails>
    </channel>
    <channel GrabEpg="False" IdChannel="6" IsRadio="False" IsTv="True" LastGrabTime="2000-1-1 0:0:0" SortOrder="10000" TimesWatched="0" TotalTimeWatched="2000-1-1 0:0:0" VisibleInGuide="True" DisplayName="Novo SD TSC13 -03" ChannelNumber="10000">
      <mappings>
        <map IdCard="3" IdChannel="6" IdChannelMap="6" />
      </mappings>
      <TuningDetails>
        <tune IdChannel="6" IdTuning="6" Bandwidth="8" ChannelNumber="10000" ChannelType="4" CountryId="31" Diseqc="0" FreeToAir="False" Frequency="690000" MajorChannel="-1" MinorChannel="-1" Modulation="0" Name="Novo SD TSC13 -03" NetworkId="54" PmtPid="817" Polarisation="0" Provider="Novo SD TSC13 -03" ServiceId="1655" SwitchingFrequency="0" Symbolrate="0" TransportId="73" TuningSource="0" VideoSource="0" AudioSource="0" IsVCRSignal="False" SatIndex="-1" InnerFecRate="-1" Band="0" Pilot="-1" RollOff="-1" Url="" Bitrate="0" />
      </TuningDetails>
    </channel>
    <channel GrabEpg="False" IdChannel="7" IsRadio="False" IsTv="True" LastGrabTime="2000-1-1 0:0:0" SortOrder="10000" TimesWatched="0" TotalTimeWatched="2000-1-1 0:0:0" VisibleInGuide="True" DisplayName="Toros TV" ChannelNumber="10000">
      <mappings>
        <map IdCard="3" IdChannel="7" IdChannelMap="7" />
      </mappings>
      <TuningDetails>
        <tune IdChannel="7" IdTuning="7" Bandwidth="8" ChannelNumber="10000" ChannelType="4" CountryId="31" Diseqc="0" FreeToAir="False" Frequency="690000" MajorChannel="-1" MinorChannel="-1" Modulation="0" Name="Toros TV" NetworkId="54" PmtPid="817" Polarisation="0" Provider="Toros TV" ServiceId="1656" SwitchingFrequency="0" Symbolrate="0" TransportId="73" TuningSource="0" VideoSource="0" AudioSource="0" IsVCRSignal="False" SatIndex="-1" InnerFecRate="-1" Band="0" Pilot="-1" RollOff="-1" Url="" Bitrate="0" />
      </TuningDetails>
    </channel>
    <channel GrabEpg="False" IdChannel="8" IsRadio="False" IsTv="True" LastGrabTime="2000-1-1 0:0:0" SortOrder="10000" TimesWatched="0" TotalTimeWatched="2000-1-1 0:0:0" VisibleInGuide="True" DisplayName="Novo SD TSC13 -04" ChannelNumber="10000">
      <mappings>
        <map IdCard="3" IdChannel="8" IdChannelMap="8" />
      </mappings>
      <TuningDetails>
        <tune IdChannel="8" IdTuning="8" Bandwidth="8" ChannelNumber="10000" ChannelType="4" CountryId="31" Diseqc="0" FreeToAir="False" Frequency="690000" MajorChannel="-1" MinorChannel="-1" Modulation="0" Name="Novo SD TSC13 -04" NetworkId="54" PmtPid="817" Polarisation="0" Provider="Novo SD TSC13 -04" ServiceId="1657" SwitchingFrequency="0" Symbolrate="0" TransportId="73" TuningSource="0" VideoSource="0" AudioSource="0" IsVCRSignal="False" SatIndex="-1" InnerFecRate="-1" Band="0" Pilot="-1" RollOff="-1" Url="" Bitrate="0" />
      </TuningDetails>
    </channel>
    <channel GrabEpg="False" IdChannel="9" IsRadio="False" IsTv="True" LastGrabTime="2000-1-1 0:0:0" SortOrder="10000" TimesWatched="0" TotalTimeWatched="2000-1-1 0:0:0" VisibleInGuide="True" DisplayName="E! Entertainment" ChannelNumber="10000">
      <mappings>
        <map IdCard="3" IdChannel="9" IdChannelMap="9" />
      </mappings>
      <TuningDetails>
        <tune IdChannel="9" IdTuning="9" Bandwidth="8" ChannelNumber="10000" ChannelType="4" CountryId="31" Diseqc="0" FreeToAir="False" Frequency="690000" MajorChannel="-1" MinorChannel="-1" Modulation="0" Name="E! Entertainment" NetworkId="54" PmtPid="817" Polarisation="0" Provider="SID E! Entertainment" ServiceId="1658" SwitchingFrequency="0" Symbolrate="0" TransportId="73" TuningSource="0" VideoSource="0" AudioSource="0" IsVCRSignal="False" SatIndex="-1" InnerFecRate="-1" Band="0" Pilot="-1" RollOff="-1" Url="" Bitrate="0" />
      </TuningDetails>
    </channel>
    <channel GrabEpg="False" IdChannel="10" IsRadio="False" IsTv="True" LastGrabTime="2000-1-1 0:0:0" SortOrder="10000" TimesWatched="0" TotalTimeWatched="2000-1-1 0:0:0" VisibleInGuide="True" DisplayName="BBC Entertainment" ChannelNumber="10000">
      <mappings>
        <map IdCard="3" IdChannel="10" IdChannelMap="10" />
      </mappings>
      <TuningDetails>
        <tune IdChannel="10" IdTuning="10" Bandwidth="8" ChannelNumber="10000" ChannelType="4" CountryId="31" Diseqc="0" FreeToAir="False" Frequency="690000" MajorChannel="-1" MinorChannel="-1" Modulation="0" Name="BBC Entertainment" NetworkId="54" PmtPid="817" Polarisation="0" Provider="SID BBC Entertainment" ServiceId="1659" SwitchingFrequency="0" Symbolrate="0" TransportId="73" TuningSource="0" VideoSource="0" AudioSource="0" IsVCRSignal="False" SatIndex="-1" InnerFecRate="-1" Band="0" Pilot="-1" RollOff="-1" Url="" Bitrate="0" />
      </TuningDetails>
    </channel>
    <channel GrabEpg="False" IdChannel="11" IsRadio="False" IsTv="True" LastGrabTime="2000-1-1 0:0:0" SortOrder="10000" TimesWatched="0" TotalTimeWatched="2000-1-1 0:0:0" VisibleInGuide="True" DisplayName="FTV" ChannelNumber="10000">
      <mappings>
        <map IdCard="3" IdChannel="11" IdChannelMap="11" />
      </mappings>
      <TuningDetails>
        <tune IdChannel="11" IdTuning="11" Bandwidth="8" ChannelNumber="10000" ChannelType="4" CountryId="31" Diseqc="0" FreeToAir="False" Frequency="690000" MajorChannel="-1" MinorChannel="-1" Modulation="0" Name="FTV" NetworkId="54" PmtPid="817" Polarisation="0" Provider="SID FTV" ServiceId="1660" SwitchingFrequency="0" Symbolrate="0" TransportId="73" TuningSource="0" VideoSource="0" AudioSource="0" IsVCRSignal="False" SatIndex="-1" InnerFecRate="-1" Band="0" Pilot="-1" RollOff="-1" Url="" Bitrate="0" />
      </TuningDetails>
    </channel>
    <channel GrabEpg="False" IdChannel="12" IsRadio="False" IsTv="True" LastGrabTime="2000-1-1 0:0:0" SortOrder="10000" TimesWatched="0" TotalTimeWatched="2000-1-1 0:0:0" VisibleInGuide="True" DisplayName="Novo SD TSC13 -05" ChannelNumber="10000">
      <mappings>
        <map IdCard="3" IdChannel="12" IdChannelMap="12" />
      </mappings>
      <TuningDetails>
        <tune IdChannel="12" IdTuning="12" Bandwidth="8" ChannelNumber="10000" ChannelType="4" CountryId="31" Diseqc="0" FreeToAir="False" Frequency="690000" MajorChannel="-1" MinorChannel="-1" Modulation="0" Name="Novo SD TSC13 -05" NetworkId="54" PmtPid="817" Polarisation="0" Provider="Novo SD TSC13 -05" ServiceId="1661" SwitchingFrequency="0" Symbolrate="0" TransportId="73" TuningSource="0" VideoSource="0" AudioSource="0" IsVCRSignal="False" SatIndex="-1" InnerFecRate="-1" Band="0" Pilot="-1" RollOff="-1" Url="" Bitrate="0" />
      </TuningDetails>
    </channel>
    <channel GrabEpg="False" IdChannel="13" IsRadio="False" IsTv="True" LastGrabTime="2000-1-1 0:0:0" SortOrder="10000" TimesWatched="0" TotalTimeWatched="2000-1-1 0:0:0" VisibleInGuide="True" DisplayName="Canal de Teste" ChannelNumber="10000">
      <mappings>
        <map IdCard="3" IdChannel="13" IdChannelMap="13" />
      </mappings>
      <TuningDetails>
        <tune IdChannel="13" IdTuning="13" Bandwidth="8" ChannelNumber="10000" ChannelType="4" CountryId="31" Diseqc="0" FreeToAir="True" Frequency="714000" MajorChannel="-1" MinorChannel="-1" Modulation="0" Name="Canal de Teste" NetworkId="54" PmtPid="817" Polarisation="0" Provider="Canal de Testes" ServiceId="1" SwitchingFrequency="0" Symbolrate="0" TransportId="36" TuningSource="0" VideoSource="0" AudioSource="0" IsVCRSignal="False" SatIndex="-1" InnerFecRate="-1" Band="0" Pilot="-1" RollOff="-1" Url="" Bitrate="0" />
      </TuningDetails>
    </channel>
    <channel GrabEpg="False" IdChannel="14" IsRadio="False" IsTv="True" LastGrabTime="2000-1-1 0:0:0" SortOrder="10000" TimesWatched="0" TotalTimeWatched="2000-1-1 0:0:0" VisibleInGuide="True" DisplayName="RTP 3" ChannelNumber="10000">
      <mappings>
        <map IdCard="3" IdChannel="14" IdChannelMap="14" />
      </mappings>
      <TuningDetails>
        <tune IdChannel="14" IdTuning="14" Bandwidth="8" ChannelNumber="10000" ChannelType="4" CountryId="31" Diseqc="0" FreeToAir="False" Frequency="714000" MajorChannel="-1" MinorChannel="-1" Modulation="0" Name="RTP 3" NetworkId="54" PmtPid="817" Polarisation="0" Provider="SID RTP 3" ServiceId="101" SwitchingFrequency="0" Symbolrate="0" TransportId="36" TuningSource="0" VideoSource="0" AudioSource="0" IsVCRSignal="False" SatIndex="-1" InnerFecRate="-1" Band="0" Pilot="-1" RollOff="-1" Url="" Bitrate="0" />
      </TuningDetails>
    </channel>
    <channel GrabEpg="False" IdChannel="15" IsRadio="False" IsTv="True" LastGrabTime="2000-1-1 0:0:0" SortOrder="10000" TimesWatched="0" TotalTimeWatched="2000-1-1 0:0:0" VisibleInGuide="True" DisplayName="BTV 1" ChannelNumber="10000">
      <mappings>
        <map IdCard="3" IdChannel="15" IdChannelMap="15" />
      </mappings>
      <TuningDetails>
        <tune IdChannel="15" IdTuning="15" Bandwidth="8" ChannelNumber="10000" ChannelType="4" CountryId="31" Diseqc="0" FreeToAir="False" Frequency="714000" MajorChannel="-1" MinorChannel="-1" Modulation="0" Name="BTV 1" NetworkId="54" PmtPid="817" Polarisation="0" Provider="SID BTV 1" ServiceId="105" SwitchingFrequency="0" Symbolrate="0" TransportId="36" TuningSource="0" VideoSource="0" AudioSource="0" IsVCRSignal="False" SatIndex="-1" InnerFecRate="-1" Band="0" Pilot="-1" RollOff="-1" Url="" Bitrate="0" />
      </TuningDetails>
    </channel>
    <channel GrabEpg="False" IdChannel="16" IsRadio="False" IsTv="True" LastGrabTime="2000-1-1 0:0:0" SortOrder="10000" TimesWatched="0" TotalTimeWatched="2000-1-1 0:0:0" VisibleInGuide="True" DisplayName="Novo SD TSCZT - 01" ChannelNumber="10000">
      <mappings>
        <map IdCard="3" IdChannel="16" IdChannelMap="16" />
      </mappings>
      <TuningDetails>
        <tune IdChannel="16" IdTuning="16" Bandwidth="8" ChannelNumber="10000" ChannelType="4" CountryId="31" Diseqc="0" FreeToAir="False" Frequency="714000" MajorChannel="-1" MinorChannel="-1" Modulation="0" Name="Novo SD TSCZT - 01" NetworkId="54" PmtPid="817" Polarisation="0" Provider="SID Novo SD TSCZT - 01" ServiceId="106" SwitchingFrequency="0" Symbolrate="0" TransportId="36" TuningSource="0" VideoSource="0" AudioSource="0" IsVCRSignal="False" SatIndex="-1" InnerFecRate="-1" Band="0" Pilot="-1" RollOff="-1" Url="" Bitrate="0" />
      </TuningDetails>
    </channel>
    <channel GrabEpg="False" IdChannel="17" IsRadio="False" IsTv="True" LastGrabTime="2000-1-1 0:0:0" SortOrder="8" TimesWatched="0" TotalTimeWatched="2000-1-1 0:0:0" VisibleInGuide="True" DisplayName="Canal de Teste" ChannelNumber="8">
      <mappings>
        <map IdCard="3" IdChannel="17" IdChannelMap="17" />
      </mappings>
      <TuningDetails>
        <tune IdChannel="17" IdTuning="17" Bandwidth="8" ChannelNumber="8" ChannelType="4" CountryId="31" Diseqc="0" FreeToAir="True" Frequency="714000" MajorChannel="-1" MinorChannel="-1" Modulation="0" Name="Canal de Teste" NetworkId="54" PmtPid="817" Polarisation="0" Provider="Canal de Testes" ServiceId="111" SwitchingFrequency="0" Symbolrate="0" TransportId="36" TuningSource="0" VideoSource="0" AudioSource="0" IsVCRSignal="False" SatIndex="-1" InnerFecRate="-1" Band="0" Pilot="-1" RollOff="-1" Url="" Bitrate="0" />
      </TuningDetails>
    </channel>
    <channel GrabEpg="False" IdChannel="18" IsRadio="False" IsTv="True" LastGrabTime="2000-1-1 0:0:0" SortOrder="10000" TimesWatched="0" TotalTimeWatched="2000-1-1 0:0:0" VisibleInGuide="True" DisplayName="Canal Panda" ChannelNumber="10000">
      <mappings>
        <map IdCard="3" IdChannel="18" IdChannelMap="18" />
      </mappings>
      <TuningDetails>
        <tune IdChannel="18" IdTuning="18" Bandwidth="8" ChannelNumber="10000" ChannelType="4" CountryId="31" Diseqc="0" FreeToAir="False" Frequency="714000" MajorChannel="-1" MinorChannel="-1" Modulation="0" Name="Canal Panda" NetworkId="54" PmtPid="817" Polarisation="0" Provider="SID Panda" ServiceId="708" SwitchingFrequency="0" Symbolrate="0" TransportId="36" TuningSource="0" VideoSource="0" AudioSource="0" IsVCRSignal="False" SatIndex="-1" InnerFecRate="-1" Band="0" Pilot="-1" RollOff="-1" Url="" Bitrate="0" />
      </TuningDetails>
    </channel>
    <channel GrabEpg="False" IdChannel="19" IsRadio="False" IsTv="True" LastGrabTime="2000-1-1 0:0:0" SortOrder="10000" TimesWatched="0" TotalTimeWatched="2000-1-1 0:0:0" VisibleInGuide="True" DisplayName="SIC Notícias" ChannelNumber="10000">
      <mappings>
        <map IdCard="3" IdChannel="19" IdChannelMap="19" />
      </mappings>
      <TuningDetails>
        <tune IdChannel="19" IdTuning="19" Bandwidth="8" ChannelNumber="10000" ChannelType="4" CountryId="31" Diseqc="0" FreeToAir="False" Frequency="714000" MajorChannel="-1" MinorChannel="-1" Modulation="0" Name="SIC Notícias" NetworkId="54" PmtPid="817" Polarisation="0" Provider="SID SIC N" ServiceId="801" SwitchingFrequency="0" Symbolrate="0" TransportId="36" TuningSource="0" VideoSource="0" AudioSource="0" IsVCRSignal="False" SatIndex="-1" InnerFecRate="-1" Band="0" Pilot="-1" RollOff="-1" Url="" Bitrate="0" />
      </TuningDetails>
    </channel>
    <channel GrabEpg="False" IdChannel="20" IsRadio="False" IsTv="True" LastGrabTime="2000-1-1 0:0:0" SortOrder="1" TimesWatched="0" TotalTimeWatched="2000-1-1 0:0:0" VisibleInGuide="True" DisplayName="RTP 1" ChannelNumber="1">
      <mappings>
        <map IdCard="3" IdChannel="20" IdChannelMap="20" />
      </mappings>
      <TuningDetails>
        <tune IdChannel="20" IdTuning="20" Bandwidth="8" ChannelNumber="1" ChannelType="4" CountryId="31" Diseqc="0" FreeToAir="True" Frequency="714000" MajorChannel="-1" MinorChannel="-1" Modulation="0" Name="RTP 1" NetworkId="54" PmtPid="817" Polarisation="0" Provider="SID RTP1" ServiceId="811" SwitchingFrequency="0" Symbolrate="0" TransportId="36" TuningSource="0" VideoSource="0" AudioSource="0" IsVCRSignal="False" SatIndex="-1" InnerFecRate="-1" Band="0" Pilot="-1" RollOff="-1" Url="" Bitrate="0" />
      </TuningDetails>
    </channel>
    <channel GrabEpg="False" IdChannel="21" IsRadio="False" IsTv="True" LastGrabTime="2000-1-1 0:0:0" SortOrder="2" TimesWatched="0" TotalTimeWatched="2000-1-1 0:0:0" VisibleInGuide="True" DisplayName="RTP 2" ChannelNumber="2">
      <mappings>
        <map IdCard="3" IdChannel="21" IdChannelMap="21" />
      </mappings>
      <TuningDetails>
        <tune IdChannel="21" IdTuning="21" Bandwidth="8" ChannelNumber="2" ChannelType="4" CountryId="31" Diseqc="0" FreeToAir="True" Frequency="714000" MajorChannel="-1" MinorChannel="-1" Modulation="0" Name="RTP 2" NetworkId="54" PmtPid="817" Polarisation="0" Provider="SID RTP 2" ServiceId="812" SwitchingFrequency="0" Symbolrate="0" TransportId="36" TuningSource="0" VideoSource="0" AudioSource="0" IsVCRSignal="False" SatIndex="-1" InnerFecRate="-1" Band="0" Pilot="-1" RollOff="-1" Url="" Bitrate="0" />
      </TuningDetails>
    </channel>
    <channel GrabEpg="False" IdChannel="22" IsRadio="False" IsTv="True" LastGrabTime="2000-1-1 0:0:0" SortOrder="3" TimesWatched="0" TotalTimeWatched="2000-1-1 0:0:0" VisibleInGuide="True" DisplayName="SIC" ChannelNumber="3">
      <mappings>
        <map IdCard="3" IdChannel="22" IdChannelMap="22" />
      </mappings>
      <TuningDetails>
        <tune IdChannel="22" IdTuning="22" Bandwidth="8" ChannelNumber="3" ChannelType="4" CountryId="31" Diseqc="0" FreeToAir="True" Frequency="714000" MajorChannel="-1" MinorChannel="-1" Modulation="0" Name="SIC" NetworkId="54" PmtPid="817" Polarisation="0" Provider="SID SIC" ServiceId="813" SwitchingFrequency="0" Symbolrate="0" TransportId="36" TuningSource="0" VideoSource="0" AudioSource="0" IsVCRSignal="False" SatIndex="-1" InnerFecRate="-1" Band="0" Pilot="-1" RollOff="-1" Url="" Bitrate="0" />
      </TuningDetails>
    </channel>
    <channel GrabEpg="False" IdChannel="23" IsRadio="False" IsTv="True" LastGrabTime="2000-1-1 0:0:0" SortOrder="4" TimesWatched="0" TotalTimeWatched="2000-1-1 0:0:0" VisibleInGuide="True" DisplayName="TVI" ChannelNumber="4">
      <mappings>
        <map IdCard="3" IdChannel="23" IdChannelMap="23" />
      </mappings>
      <TuningDetails>
        <tune IdChannel="23" IdTuning="23" Bandwidth="8" ChannelNumber="4" ChannelType="4" CountryId="31" Diseqc="0" FreeToAir="True" Frequency="714000" MajorChannel="-1" MinorChannel="-1" Modulation="0" Name="TVI" NetworkId="54" PmtPid="817" Polarisation="0" Provider="SID TVI" ServiceId="814" SwitchingFrequency="0" Symbolrate="0" TransportId="36" TuningSource="0" VideoSource="0" AudioSource="0" IsVCRSignal="False" SatIndex="-1" InnerFecRate="-1" Band="0" Pilot="-1" RollOff="-1" Url="" Bitrate="0" />
      </TuningDetails>
    </channel>
    <channel GrabEpg="False" IdChannel="24" IsRadio="False" IsTv="True" LastGrabTime="2000-1-1 0:0:0" SortOrder="10000" TimesWatched="0" TotalTimeWatched="2000-1-1 0:0:0" VisibleInGuide="True" DisplayName="DSMCC - IPPV" ChannelNumber="10000">
      <mappings>
        <map IdCard="3" IdChannel="24" IdChannelMap="24" />
      </mappings>
      <TuningDetails>
        <tune IdChannel="24" IdTuning="24" Bandwidth="8" ChannelNumber="10000" ChannelType="4" CountryId="31" Diseqc="0" FreeToAir="False" Frequency="714000" MajorChannel="-1" MinorChannel="-1" Modulation="0" Name="DSMCC - IPPV" NetworkId="54" PmtPid="817" Polarisation="0" Provider="TVCABO" ServiceId="2004" SwitchingFrequency="0" Symbolrate="0" TransportId="36" TuningSource="0" VideoSource="0" AudioSource="0" IsVCRSignal="False" SatIndex="-1" InnerFecRate="-1" Band="0" Pilot="-1" RollOff="-1" Url="" Bitrate="0" />
      </TuningDetails>
    </channel>
    <channel GrabEpg="False" IdChannel="25" IsRadio="False" IsTv="True" LastGrabTime="2000-1-1 0:0:0" SortOrder="10000" TimesWatched="0" TotalTimeWatched="2000-1-1 0:0:0" VisibleInGuide="True" DisplayName="DSMCC - RADIOS" ChannelNumber="10000">
      <mappings>
        <map IdCard="3" IdChannel="25" IdChannelMap="25" />
      </mappings>
      <TuningDetails>
        <tune IdChannel="25" IdTuning="25" Bandwidth="8" ChannelNumber="10000" ChannelType="4" CountryId="31" Diseqc="0" FreeToAir="True" Frequency="714000" MajorChannel="-1" MinorChannel="-1" Modulation="0" Name="DSMCC - RADIOS" NetworkId="54" PmtPid="817" Polarisation="0" Provider="DSMCC - RADIOS" ServiceId="2005" SwitchingFrequency="0" Symbolrate="0" TransportId="36" TuningSource="0" VideoSource="0" AudioSource="0" IsVCRSignal="False" SatIndex="-1" InnerFecRate="-1" Band="0" Pilot="-1" RollOff="-1" Url="" Bitrate="0" />
      </TuningDetails>
    </channel>
  </channels>

RE: Why is this so complex? - Added by Kev S about 8 years ago

Ah ha, try
690000000 Hz with the rest as auto.

I also notice there was a mistake in the earlier advice (I think)

Symbol Rate: 6875
Constellation: QAM64

That symbol rate should have been 6875000 - dvb-s is normally quoted as MSym/s and therefore needs multiplying by 1000, dvb-c is likly to be the same

RE: Why is this so complex? - Added by Kev S about 8 years ago

Have you tried with the symbol rate at 0?, IIRC that's auto detect.

RE: Why is this so complex? - Added by Tiago Silva about 8 years ago

Yes, its in the first image, nothing.

RE: Why is this so complex? - Added by saen acro about 8 years ago

@Tiago Silva
Is Your operator have web page with frequency parameters ?
With operator is this?

read this and experiment
https://www.linuxtv.org/wiki/index.php/Dvbscan
https://www.linuxtv.org/wiki/index.php/Dvb-fe-tool

RE: Why is this so complex? - Added by Tiago Silva about 8 years ago

I already posted my operator and page with the frequencies, i still don't know the other parameters.

RE: Why is this so complex? - Added by saen acro about 8 years ago 

freq 714000 UHF Canal 85
NIT Pesquisa On

Frequências usadas na zona Barreiro:
Frequência - Inversion - Simbol Rate - Modulation - Fec
170 - Auto - 06000 - QAM256 - Auto
198 - Auto - 06000 - QAM128 - Auto
205 - Auto - 06000 - QAM256 - Auto
219 - Auto - 06000 - QAM256 - Auto
240 - Auto - 06000 - QAM128 - Auto
261 - Auto - 06000 - QAM256 - Auto
268 - Auto - 06000 - QAM256 - Auto
306 - Auto - 06900 - QAM256 - Auto - só canais teste
314 - Auto - 06900 - QAM256 - Auto - só canais teste
322 - Auto - 06900 - QAM256 - Auto - só canais teste
330 - Auto - 06900 - QAM256 - Auto - só canais teste
338 - Auto - 06875 - QAM128 - Auto
346 - Auto - 06875 - QAM128 - Auto
354 - Auto - 06900 - QAM256 - Auto
362 - Auto - 06900 - QAM256 - Auto - só canais teste
370 - Auto - 06900 - QAM256 - Auto - só canais teste
378 - Auto - 06900 - QAM256 - Auto - só canais teste
386 - Auto - 06900 - QAM256 - Auto - só canais teste
498 - Auto - 06900 - QAM256 - Auto
522 - Auto - 06900 - QAM256 - Auto
538 - Auto - 06900 - QAM256 - Auto
554 - Auto - 06900 - QAM256 - Auto
562 - Auto - 06900 - QAM256 - Auto
618 - Auto - 06900 - QAM256 - Auto
650 - Auto - 06875 - QAM128 - Auto
658 - Auto - 06875 - QAM128 - Auto
666 - Auto - 06900 - QAM256 - Auto
690 - Auto - 06900 - QAM256 - Auto
706 - Auto - 06900 - QAM256 - Auto
714 - Auto - 06900 - QAM64 - Auto
666 - Auto - 06900 - QAM256 - Auto

RE: Why is this so complex? - Added by Tiago Silva about 8 years ago

I don't live in the Barreiro Area, and i tried a couple of those and failed.

RE: Why is this so complex? - Added by Tiago Silva about 8 years ago

Ok so i went to my cable provider store and asked for the frequencies and other parameters and i got this:
http://i.imgur.com/KUcJSwB.jpg

This shows that i should find at 714 Mhz, a Symbol Rate of 6875 (6975000 ?) and a Modulation/Constelation of QAM-64.

But i get NOTHING :(, i borrowed another tv tunner even, an eye-tv hibrid, and got the same frustrating results.

My crappy old tv is still 1.000x easier, just auto scan and done, unbelievable.

RE: Why is this so complex? - Added by Mark Clarkstone about 8 years ago

Tiago Silva wrote:

Ok so i went to my cable provider store and asked for the frequencies and other parameters and i got this:
http://i.imgur.com/KUcJSwB.jpg

This shows that i should find at 714 Mhz, a Symbol Rate of 6875 (6975000 ?) and a Modulation/Constelation of QAM-64.

But i get NOTHING :(, i borrowed another tv tunner even, an eye-tv hibrid, and got the same frustrating results.

My crappy old tv is still 1.000x easier, just auto scan and done, unbelievable.

Can you try something like w_scan & see if that actually see's anything? If that fails to find anything then that would suggest there is an issue with the system/driver. If you do get something from w_scan that should tell you what you need to enter in Tvheadend.

You've said that the device is working on Windows, so it should work perfectly fine on Linux provided that the driver isn't causing any issues, hence why I suggest you try w_scan. If that does output something Tvheadend should also have no issues tuning to the frequency.

RE: Why is this so complex? - Added by Tiago Silva about 8 years ago

How can i use w_scan? I tried install it and never made it, the libreelec forum support was ridiculously unhelpful: https://forum.libreelec.tv/thread-1980.html

RE: Why is this so complex? - Added by Mark Clarkstone about 8 years ago

Tiago Silva wrote:

How can i use w_scan? I tried install it and never made it, the libreelec forum support was ridiculously unhelpful: https://forum.libreelec.tv/thread-1980.html

What has been written in that thread is true, you can't normally install things on libreelec, but the good news is that from what I understand is that w_scan is already included on libreelec 8 beta, so you may want to give that a try using a USB stick.

See: https://libreelec.tv/downloads/preview/ and the commits here mention that w_scan is now included. You just need to install it via the addons menu (select dvb-tools).

RE: Why is this so complex? - Added by Tiago Silva about 8 years ago

Thank you, finally i could use w_scan. Unfortunately my tvtunner doesn't work with the beta, but at least the one i borrowed did..
Here is the full output: https://docs.google.com/document/d/1b6M3Kfvi5TLv-zFfWV-T7EgK5qC-I_pJUFHO7bmd9A8/edit?usp=sharing

I'm getting a lot of warnings and errors, what's wrong? But it did find some services, i'm going to try these now.

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